View Full Version : Test drive R and GTI
Kooki
09-11-2010, 06:40 PM
Today I took the Golf GTI (manual) and the R (DSG) for a test drive.
First was the R using DSG for the first time. The paddles added that extra excitement and I began to see what DSG can do that manual could not, like quickly tapping down three gears before changing lanes. :> I thought the R had a lot of presence and the interior is very well styled. The exterior looks mean and masculine. It drives like that too. I liked the heavier steering, you really know where your at.
The GTI was quick but was more like a standard golf but with more power and a turbo. It was nice but think I would be bored over time. The clutch low down and the steering too light IMO. The R just felt something special from the moment I started to drive.
I also test drove a Megane RS 250. The RS 250 seems to perform just as well as the R but feels different in the way it delivers its performance. They both have similar power, the RS 250 has front wheel drive with LSD and the R all wheel drive.
The R seemed more exciting all the time whereas the RS at normal driving felt like any other hatchback. I really like the R.
The decision at the end of the day is whether I want to pay an extra $10K for a better styled car, better engine note and DSG.
Another option is to wait and buy a second hand R in a year. Decisions..
Jacquesvdub
09-11-2010, 06:51 PM
IMO second hand. By the time you've finished your waiting period for the R to be delivered, there will be second hand ones. Haha...
Just give me the pot and Ill stir :P.
Good review. A second hand R(not a dealer Demo one) should reduce the price depending on how long the period. I tend to agree that because these hot hatches are so responsive, these dealers and the people that test drive do trash them around. Also it does not help that it has an LC function so I can only imagine people who really know Golfs would be testing the LC on their test drives. By the time you purchase a dealer demo, your DSG is already slipping.
Kooki
09-11-2010, 08:28 PM
Thanks Jig. Yes I agree, I wouldn't consider a demo car. Only a car that has be pre-loved. DSG slipping??? LC function?? I have got a bit more homework to do.
CJ9999
09-11-2010, 08:31 PM
Thanks Jig. Yes I agree, I wouldn't consider a demo car. Only a car that has be pre-loved. DSG slipping??? LC function?? I have got a bit more homework to do.
LC = Launch Control
I like how dealers put you in the golf r before driving the gti... I had the exact same experience on my first test drive ... Drove a fully optioned golf R dsg and then drove a stock standard gti with manual.
The r with the leather, dark glass and the unique fart sound of the dsg is what won me over
Also the road presence and added weight as you mentioned
However i went and found a dsg gti with leather to also test drive and found the comparison alot better... Ended up going with the gti even tho preferred the R ... Basically came down to price because i had a monthly spend budget for lease repayments
Kooki
09-11-2010, 08:57 PM
I loved that DSG fart thing too! The first time it happened I was like WTF is that and how does it do that without my intervention (another stupid girl question). So the whole time I kept trying to get it to fart. :)
CJ9999
09-11-2010, 09:08 PM
I loved that DSG fart thing too! The first time it happened I was like WTF is that and how does it do that without my intervention (another stupid girl question). So the whole time I kept trying to get it to fart. :)
That's the beauty of computers!!
Yeah farting is the best!
Silvrfoxx
09-11-2010, 09:14 PM
Hey Kooki, been down this road a couple of months ago.. yes I felt all things you did in the comparison and hence the decision was easy to get the R. I cant see you getting your hands on a used R for some time ( in a year everyone will have only had it for eith 6 months or 6 minutes )and if one comes up it is going to be as near as the price of you ordering one and having to wait. If you want one I suggest you go and order one just to get in the queue.. if you want to cancel down the track cause you found something then you have the option..
Yeah my turbo R farts too!! Haha
G-rig
09-11-2010, 09:37 PM
Would probably help deciding to compare the same cars, ie DSG GTI... I prob wouldnt get DSG if it didn't fart, but the down changes are a lot less awkward than in a manual and great piece of tech.
Kooki
09-11-2010, 10:03 PM
Yes before today I never considered DSG. Now I am thinking it is quick, hands stay on the wheel and you can switch to auto in heavy traffic oh and it farts which just adds to the fun factor when you just idling around the streets.
Andym
09-11-2010, 10:30 PM
in true teenage fashion, can someone please film one of these farts? preferably on someones face?
funny
09-11-2010, 11:37 PM
Kooki, I wouldn't be so quick to jump in the R.
I would try them in reverse - GTI first, then R. If you have made up your mind on DSG vs manual (at least you can drive a manual, I can't!), then pick the same to test both back to back. It may make the comparison feel different.
Steering weight can also be changed if you have DCC - changing from cruising to sport does make a difference. As you said - is the R worth the 10K?
I'm sure you've taken a read of WhiteJames's review on both in the GolfMKV forum, right?
I'm sure you're itching to get into one of these from the MK3!
silverbullet
10-11-2010, 02:27 AM
try the R in manual.
Kooki
10-11-2010, 07:30 AM
Thanks Funny for the leads. I will need to re-read White James review now after driving both. Taking my time to research all my options. :)
Kooki, I wouldn't be so quick to jump in the R.
I would try them in reverse - GTI first, then R. If you have made up your mind on DSG vs manual (at least you can drive a manual, I can't!), then pick the same to test both back to back. It may make the comparison feel different.
Steering weight can also be changed if you have DCC - changing from cruising to sport does make a difference. As you said - is the R worth the 10K?
I'm sure you've taken a read of WhiteJames's review on both in the GolfMKV forum, right?
I'm sure you're itching to get into one of these from the MK3!
The difference isn't really $10K once you have factored in the standard inclusions on the R (e.g. Xenons, bigger brakes, larger turbo, 4WD). CoreyR, a mod of vwwatercooled did a cost comparison between the two cars and the difference was more like $4K.
The R is still the better value proposition over the GTI and as well as being more fun to drive. There is good reason why the waiting time for the R has now stretched to 12 months. There are 20 brand new GTIs on carsales.com.au right now while only 2 new Golf Rs (both on offer by a dealer in WA).
Angela: DSG slipping is when the drive is becoming lazy that it takes a few seconds to move forward when you push your foot to the pedal or when the DSG changes gears. Its nothing like a turbo lag kind of laziness. Its more the rpms climbs before the car moves. This usually means that the DSG clutch has been worked hard.
jesse085
10-11-2010, 12:03 PM
IMO the extra 10k for the R is worth it just for the awd system.. I hate driving my GTI in the wet..
Kooki
10-11-2010, 12:09 PM
The difference isn't really $10K once you have factored in the standard inclusions on the R (e.g. Xenons, bigger brakes, larger turbo, 4WD). CoreyR, a mod of vwwatercooled did a cost comparison between the two cars and the difference was more like $4K.
The R is still the better value proposition over the GTI and as well as being more fun to drive. There is good reason why the waiting time for the R has now stretched to 12 months. There are 20 brand new GTIs on carsales.com.au right now while only 2 new Golf Rs (both on offer by a dealer in WA).
Yeah I also came to that conclusion too when I saw the list of options that were standard with the R. I think the R is a good package and I would not hesitate paying the extra $10K over a Golf. However the R against the Megane RS is my decision. The Megane RS 250 performance set up is hard to fault but its terrible in styling. The R as an overall package is better than the Megane for an extra $10K. If I really want the R I have to wait longer and maybe have to go second hand. :(
Kooki
10-11-2010, 12:14 PM
Angela: DSG slipping is when the drive is becoming lazy that it takes a few seconds to move forward when you push your foot to the pedal or when the DSG changes gears. Its nothing like a turbo lag kind of laziness. Its more the rpms climbs before the car moves. This usually means that the DSG clutch has been worked hard.
Jig that doesn't sound to good you must be paying a price for that. DSG technology needs to become more refined?
iBoost
10-11-2010, 06:04 PM
I'd suggest driving a DSG GTI as well. At least then you have a fair comparison, they are quite different cars depending on manual or DSG.
The R is great value with the standard inclusions which are options on the GTI such as xenons and the extra power/AWD, it really comes down to how much you want to spend though.
Also, remember a quick APR tune gives the GTI a nice increase, as it does on the R, so you need to decide on your priorities, how much power you want and need and so on.
Best of luck, all three are great cars, but French cars vs German is not really a fair fight. I've had a frenchie before and build quality was not it's best feature.
Silvrfoxx
10-11-2010, 09:16 PM
Kooki, I wouldn't be so quick to jump in the R.
I would try them in reverse - GTI first, then R. If you have made up your mind on DSG vs manual (at least you can drive a manual, I can't!), then pick the same to test both back to back. It may make the comparison feel different.
Steering weight can also be changed if you have DCC - changing from cruising to sport does make a difference. As you said - is the R worth the 10K?
I'm sure you've taken a read of WhiteJames's review on both in the GolfMKV forum, right?
I'm sure you're itching to get into one of these from the MK3!
I think the latest posting from whitejames has him at a crossroads.. I can see an R in his future regardless of all the sales pitch about the GTI... the only issue I have with the GTI is that if I bought one I would always wish I bought the R and be damned with the "value" proposition.. cause I know I will never regret not having bought the GTI.. :)
random
11-11-2010, 01:16 AM
The golf R wins hands down compared to the GTI. I think it also win hands down against the Megane as well. The good R is really good value though, i was comparing it to the S3 a few weeks back, and the option list on the S3 is enormous, then you realise the number of things that comes standard in the Golf R which makes it worthy of the price tag. The AWD, engine difference, turbo difference, xenon etc. is worth the extra money.
BUT in saying the Golf R being much better than the GTI, the gti mk6 is still a relatively good car. Test driving both back to back would make the Gti alot worst than it actually is. I would say if you are seriously considering, you should test drive the gti then give it a week or 2 before test driving the R again. It is one of those electronic store scenario, you walk in look and there are like 20 TVs there, of course the biggest and most expensive ones look the best, but once you take the medium range 42" home without the comparison it is actually really good.
I don't think you would be disappointed if you take the GTI home.
So it is all down to the money and waiting time. 12 month wait is quite a long time, but in saying that the GTI has a waiting list as well if you want your personal options. I have recently decided against buying the golf R because of the 12 month waiting list (i wanted the proper fully optioned option with recaros and the lot). But then again i have a pirelli already which is better than the mk6, therefore my decision is easier than yours.
If you are willing to wait for the golf R go for it. I've done the wait before, it is extremely painful lol
Golf R would definitely be my choice put of those three cars! Very hot hatch for the money and easy to tune...
G-rig
11-11-2010, 08:44 AM
I think the latest posting from whitejames has him at a crossroads.. I can see an R in his future regardless of all the sales pitch about the GTI... the only issue I have with the GTI is that if I bought one I would always wish I bought the R and be damned with the "value" proposition.. cause I know I will never regret not having bought the GTI.. :)
I could see him getting one next time.. No point selling a new GTI if you already have it, you'd lose too much. I was considering it myself but realized they would both be similar around town and for what I use it for but wouldn't mind one in the future.
Yes before today I never considered DSG. Now I am thinking it is quick, hands stay on the wheel and you can switch to auto in heavy traffic oh and it farts which just adds to the fun factor when you just idling around the streets.
I'm a big fan of the DSG, but have always happily had manual cars. So, whenever I have driven a DSG equipped car it has usually been for no more than an hour or two; ie. not enough time for the novelty to wear off. I've driven some S series Audis and plenty of Golfs with DSG and, oddly, the only time I've come away from the experience thinking there's a clear preference for the manual was after driving a Golf R with DSG. But, my S3 is manual, so it's hard to know how much my own familiarity with that combo is clouding my judgement. Worth noting I've not managed to drive an R with a manual yet.
Anyway, I would definitely recommend testing a manual R, because, it's a tough option to reverse if the novelty of DSG does wear off, haha. Having said that, if I had to drive in heavy traffic every day then I'd tick the DSG box every time, because, it is very good. It's just that, in general terms, I enjoy using a manual more, even if it might be a few tenths slower when it matters most.
Just a comment on the price difference - its only around $4k to $5k assuming you want the exact options on the gti which come standard on the R i.e. bi-xenon, park sensors, 18inch rims etc
but if you compare base gti to base R then the price diff is alot more. This is obviously pretty silly and the most useful comparison is for someone that wishes to option up a GTI should seriously take a look at the R.
When I was shopping for prices I spec'd only the bare minimum options that i wanted on a GTI, leather, detroits, mdi vs a Golf R, leather, black 19s both with DSG and 5DR. I got the Golf R down to $57,100 driveaway with corporate discount and I ended up getting the GTI for $46k driveaway ... almost exactly $11k diff.
It was a pretty tough choice, but I only drive ~10k kms a year so my sensible side told me to go with the GTI and do some light mods to get the enjoyment factor but I agree - the Golf R is a very realistic choice for someone who was going to option up their GTI anyway!
G-rig
11-11-2010, 08:06 PM
agree, you should really compare both cars in stock form, and the difference is at least 10k.
the 18" wheels also look a bit small on the R so would be comparing it to that including any other options as as most people don't want a stock car. New stock GTI's are very good value though around the 41k mark.
Kooki
11-11-2010, 10:09 PM
Lima, I am going to test the manual R as that does seem to be the next logical step. I did wonder that the novelty of the DSG could wear off over time. I don't get stuck in traffic much so that wouldn't justify a DSG option.
Romp exactly, a GTI plus mods = R. Why not spend the same money and get a R. Unless you like to do your own mods. I am just not going down that road.
Silvrfoxx
11-11-2010, 10:34 PM
I could see him getting one next time.. No point selling a new GTI if you already have it, you'd lose too much. I was considering it myself but realized they would both be similar around town and for what I use it for but wouldn't mind one in the future.Agree entirely.. if you have a quality ride the upgrade doesnt make sense
Novelty? I don't think of my DSG as a novelty.. I have owned manuals and DSG R32's and definitely think the DSG is the better option.. I pick up a 3dr golf R with DSG next week so I'll give you my opinion when I've driven it for a while.. But at the end of the day it's your choice... Goodluck
Lima, I am going to test the manual R as that does seem to be the next logical step. I did wonder that the novelty of the DSG could wear off over time. I don't get stuck in traffic much so that wouldn't justify a DSG option.
Romp exactly, a GTI plus mods = R. Why not spend the same money and get a R. Unless you like to do your own mods. I am just not going down that road.
danielb
11-11-2010, 10:54 PM
4k difference between GTI and R? Yeah right!
If i got the R i'd have to get the recaro option. I'm glad it's not an option on the GTI to be honest, as i probably would've gotten it :lol:
I got my GTI for 41.5k on the road. It'd be impossible to get a new R on road for 45.5k.
Having said that though, i put a deposit down on the GTI before the pricing info and release date were released for the R. I probably would've gone for the R had i been at that stage a month later.
Novelty? I don't think of my DSG as a novelty.. I have owned manuals and DSG R32's and definitely think the DSG is the better option.. I pick up a 3dr golf R with DSG next week so I'll give you my opinion when I've driven it for a while.. But at the end of the day it's your choice... Goodluck
Has someone hacked your account? I don't follow.
What about your big-ass white Scirocco? Still coming, just a bit later?
Best wishes for both - and thumbsup for the new car!
Kooki, keep an open mind, even if you think that you will have less fun without self-shifting with your hand. You might sometime enjoy lots of power + DSG.
stephen8512
11-11-2010, 11:53 PM
At the end of the day, it comes down to what you FEEL more comfortable in.
I havent driven a manual R but I drove a manual GTI and though it felt like I was shaking hands with an old friend on the stick shift, ive just grown so used to the DSG. Personal choice.
Something like the transmission of a car comes down to personal preferences in my opinion. I mean, I do a lot of driving during peak hour times (early in the morning to go to uni via M2) or after work coming home from homebush bay drive, trying to take the M4/parra rd. So to me, DSG was the preferred option. Don't get me wrong, Manual GTI felt great but just something about it told me "no thanks'
stephen8512
11-11-2010, 11:55 PM
Novelty? I don't think of my DSG as a novelty.. I have owned manuals and DSG R32's and definitely think the DSG is the better option.. I pick up a 3dr golf R with DSG next week so I'll give you my opinion when I've driven it for a while.. But at the end of the day it's your choice... Goodluck
CW MK5 Golf R32 TT
CW MK6 Golf R
CW MK3 Scirocco R (soon to come)
CW R36 and you'll be set AP!!!
can't wait till u get your R! I'd love to see a 3 door CW R in the flesh.
silverbullet
12-11-2010, 12:14 AM
john2204 has a 3 door CW R. look snice.
funny
12-11-2010, 03:02 AM
The difference isn't really $10K once you have factored in the standard inclusions on the R (e.g. Xenons, bigger brakes, larger turbo, 4WD). CoreyR, a mod of vwwatercooled did a cost comparison between the two cars and the difference was more like $4K.
The R is still the better value proposition over the GTI and as well as being more fun to drive. There is good reason why the waiting time for the R has now stretched to 12 months. There are 20 brand new GTIs on carsales.com.au right now while only 2 new Golf Rs (both on offer by a dealer in WA).
That could well be due to the sales "tactics" used on Kooki being used on other impressionable buyers.
If everyone left feeling the R "wow" of course R's will sell more. I think the fact that both are now 4-pot as well means the R feels top of the 4cyl range instead of the GTI. Sharper pricing from the R side may have helped too.
There is a reason why so many MK5's sold were GTIs - upsell!!
IMO the extra 10k for the R is worth it just for the awd system.. I hate driving my GTI in the wet..
I love driving my GTI in the wet (hell i love driving it everywhere).
(When wet) It's when the differences between the GTI and the average joe blo car become ever so more apparent.
Kooki
12-11-2010, 07:27 AM
Novelty? I don't think of my DSG as a novelty.. I have owned manuals and DSG R32's and definitely think the DSG is the better option.. I pick up a 3dr golf R with DSG next week so I'll give you my opinion when I've driven it for a while.. But at the end of the day it's your choice... Goodluck
AP Thanks I would appreciate that! :)
Kooki
12-11-2010, 07:31 AM
john2204 has a 3 door CW R. look snice.
I'll check it out. I would probably opt for white and three door. :)
Silvrfoxx
12-11-2010, 08:07 AM
At the end of the day, it comes down to what you FEEL more comfortable in.
I havent driven a manual R but I drove a manual GTI and though it felt like I was shaking hands with an old friend on the stick shift, ive just grown so used to the DSG. Personal choice.
Something like the transmission of a car comes down to personal preferences in my opinion. I mean, I do a lot of driving during peak hour times (early in the morning to go to uni via M2) or after work coming home from homebush bay drive, trying to take the M4/parra rd. So to me, DSG was the preferred option. Don't get me wrong, Manual GTI felt great but just something about it told me "no thanks'Mate, that sounds similar to my run to and from work and was wondering what the commute would be like with the DSG.. I drove the R in the test drive and was aware of the lag and the gear hunting in traffic but it was not problematic.. but an hour isnt enough to get a real sense of how it manages. Is it something that learns and you smooth out the gear change or your driving style.. or overall is the gear changes just what they are
DEMIGODGTI
12-11-2010, 11:07 AM
I love my MY10 GTI. I also love the R. I just didn't want to wait 12 months for a freakin car... :)
stephen8512
12-11-2010, 12:15 PM
Mate, that sounds similar to my run to and from work and was wondering what the commute would be like with the DSG.. I drove the R in the test drive and was aware of the lag and the gear hunting in traffic but it was not problematic.. but an hour isnt enough to get a real sense of how it manages. Is it something that learns and you smooth out the gear change or your driving style.. or overall is the gear changes just what they are
the ECU learns your driving style as far as i am aware? so the DSG upchange/downchanges would be based on how u drive normally and it will learn the pattern.....or something like that.
However it would probably still shift into 6th relatively quickly as it does normally for fuel saving purposes
john2204
12-11-2010, 03:31 PM
I will be putting up Pic of my R in the next hr or so, keep you eyes out for a new thread ;)
Congrats, John, please add your review, once you've given it a good drive.
Where are you located?
john2204
12-11-2010, 05:23 PM
Pic up, located in Syd :)
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